Kenny Phillips and Antrel Rolle

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Kenny Phillips and Antrel Rolle

Written by Andy Furman

Sunday, 07 March 2010 00:00

The Giants went out of their way to point out that Rolle was not signed because of Philips' injury.

"The idea that this is associated with the Kenny Phillips situation is incorrect," Coach Tom Coughlin said. "We needed to answer some questions in terms of the safety position. This move puts us in a position now where we feel this can be a really strong part of our team. We needed to really solidify and help the safety position based on last year's experience. That's the reason this objective was so important to us."

If we simply take Coughlin at his word, then this would obviously be fantastic. But anyone with any knowledge of football has to understand that the one thing consistently done in football is for teams not to disclose the extent of injuries. The Giants were mum on Phillips for weeks during preseason and then only let on that this would be "a season-long issue" when the season began/after Washington. Why? Because just as in poker, you can never let the opponent know precisely what is in your hand. It is best for them to think that you are playing with no weaknesses. Then they will not know whether to trade up in front of you for that Safety or not when the draft Rolles around.

Last August/September, the Giants were desperately thin before Phillips' knee. You know that Reese was on the prowl for any Safety with 2 legs and a pulse at that point. He did not need the extent of Phillip's knee disclosed any more than necessary.

None of us are Doctors. We can speculate all day and all night about Phillips' knee. What we do know about microfracture surgery is this:
1) It's chances for success are anything but a lock.
2) The chances for success go up for players in their 20's compared to players in their 30's.
3) A year or two after coming back, a player can lose the gains that were initially made.

What are the Giants going to say at this point? I remember very well the Bears preseason game this past August. On one play I saw Jay Alford's knee turned into a pretzel and feared the worst. The Giants said it was a sprain, but we said to hold on, wait for confirmation... because we did not believe the "sprain" diagnosis. The point is that when it comes to injuries, you never get the complete story. Look at Brandon Jacobs this past year- he was hurt in WEEK 1! If Phillips is making a great comeback, fantastic, but all we are saying here is that ANYTHING is possible whenever they talk about these things. If Phillips is 100% the Giants should STILL grab a Safety high in this draft, even AFTER Rolle. That is how depleted they are here. So if I was running the team, publicly I'd be saying how wonderful Phillips is whether he is or isn't. That is Poker 101.

Summary: It will be great when Phillips is recovered and playing well this summer. The Giants (/all NFL teams) have never been completely forthcoming on injuries and we should never assume what they say is correct. Draft a Safety high this April regardless of Phillips' progress.

Comments (13) Add Comment

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written by irishmacmystic, March 07, 2010

very well put andy...we have to protect ourselves in the draft, though the signing of rolle in my opinion at least lets us think about moving the idea of a safety to round 2 to round 5...i would not be reluctant to take one in round 2, but i think there is slightly less urgency now, and..there are many safeties in this draft... i would think we are looking at a strong safety now or someone who can play both....rashed jones GA or chad jones LSU (chad apparently stunk at the combine according to peter) in round 2, morgan burnett ga tech (free safety in college could play both) round 2 or round 3; further down Darrell Stuckey Kansas, Larry Asante Nebraska, Myron Rolle.FL St (the Rhodes Scholar)..if we want to concentrate on LB and DT in rounds 1 and 2, i think stuckey would be a good pick in either round 3 or round 4...Myron Rolle may even be there in round 5, due to a year off and bad 40 time at the combine...could be a bargain pick at that point...Are we assuming that we are done with the idea of sharper? or ryan clark?

About myron rolle........
written by Slater, March 07, 2010

Buyer beware, he is without question the most overhyped player in the draft. He comes with a great story and great character but he almost looked undraftable at the combine. It wasnt just his 40 time, during the DB drills he looked stiff and slow.

Great human being, questionable football player

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written by I Bleed Blue, March 07, 2010

Looks like Da Bears are taking a page out of Daniel Snyder's book. In signing DE Julius Peppers, RB Chester Taylor, and TE Brandon Manumaleuna -- they shelled out $121 million, $55 million of which was guaranteed. Whoaa....very uncharacteristic

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written by RobertS, March 07, 2010

The Giants spent mucho bucks for this guy. You have to wonder what the other players on the team are going to do. Will Tuck want to get a new deal?

Plus, how good is this player really? I think the move smacks of desperation. Whether or not he lives up to the contract seems irrelevant. The Giants NEEDED a capable safety and they were damn well aware of it.

As for drafting, it is science and luck. So many posters mention college players with such authority, but so often these guys just don't pan out.

As for drafting a lb in the first round, in theory it sounds right. But if anything, the giants have consistently drafted poorly for that position. Last year we spent the Shockey #2 pick and what did we get? Not an impact player and though his role has been limited, he couldn't work himself on to the field against compettion such as Danny Clark, Kehl, and Goff. And btw, how good are Kehl, and Goff? They were #3 and #4 afew years ago.

slater--happy to take the rhodes scholar off the list....
written by irishmacmystic, March 07, 2010

thanks slater..i am okay with taking myron off the list, and only would have considered him if he was there in round 5 or beyond..I will stick with rashed jones, morgan burnett if early rounds, and darrell stuckey who is likely to go in the round 3 round 4 area.......larry asante on that list too for 3rd fourth round area...he has very good size, a big hitter, good on coverage as well..vocal....he was a leader on a pretty good defense at nebraska....going for stuckey or asante makes sense, so we can use at least the first two rounds for other things...maybe even the first three rounds.......

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written by I Bleed Blue, March 07, 2010

Let's just say we have made a move in the right direction. Hopefully this will continue and we can continue to upgrade w/ free agency & the draft.

I see that Antrel Rolle wears the same number that Kenny Phillips does. Whatever number he ends up donning, I hope I see the front of the jersey more than the back of it next season. We Giants fans certainly saw too much of that last year....lol

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written by ultimatenyg, March 07, 2010

It may be a little nitpicking, but Goff and Kehl and were 4th and 5th rounders. And that is precisely the problem. The book is open on Sintim, but the Giants have not been giving adequate draft resources to LBer (1991 for the last #2 before Sintim, 1984 for the last #1), so these 4th and 5th rounders like Short, Jones, Blackburn, DeOssie, Greisen, Mallard.. Goff, Kehl.. what a collosal waste. The Giants draft RB well at that ~spot. They have failed at LBer at that spot. So they need to start from scratch and change their approach. One way to do that is to draft the size and speed that is only there in Round 1 and Round 2.

Re Tuck, great point. The Giants signed him for 5 years and 30M. He needs to be the unquestioned leader. This is the 3rd year of that deal. If I am Reese I tell him to stay healthy for 16 games and we'll redo your contract to make him the highest paid player on the defensive side of the ball.

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written by gman17, March 07, 2010

Coughlin's statement was released by the Giants. He was not pressed by a reporter to comment about Phillips. Like Andy stated, the Giants went out of their way to point out Rolle's signing does not have anything to do with Phillips. Bupkis!

Rolle did not sign with the Giants because of their facility or Kenny Phillips. He signed with the Giants for two reasons.

1. Money
2. With the loss of Warner, the Cardinals are not going anywhere. He has a better chance of getting to a Super Bowl with the Giants.

Question for andy/wonder
written by Slater, March 07, 2010

First off this question is entirely dependent on what scheme we use. For now I'm going to speculate and assume Fewell prefers and is more comfortable using a system similar to the Tampa 2.

Right now we dont have the MLB to properly use that scheme. But there are options in the draft and FA that might address that need. So... what are yours/wonders opinion of:

1) Kirk Morrison
2) Sean weatherspoon
3) Rolando McClain

assuming we run a tampa 2?

I left spikes and goff off that list because im pretty certain they dont have that kind of skillset.

IMO I think weatherspoon might have the most upside of that group but you'd have to spend a 1st rounder on him and thats alot of risk to take on if he doesnt pan out.

trade up, trade down...
written by irishmacmystic, March 07, 2010

i have been trying to figure out what it might cost us to move up in the draft to take rolando mcclain....back in 2002 we gave up our first and a 4th round pick to move up one spot to take shockey...(the titans took albert haynesworth)...in 2006 the broncos moved up four spots to take cutler, and gave the rams their first round pick and an early third round pick (i believe that was from 15 to 11 very similar in terms of where they were situated)....also in 2006 we traded the 25th pick to the steelers for their 32nd pick and a third and a fourth......i realize that every trade has its own dynamics, and that bidding wars can happen, but i am thinking it would take at least our return number 1 and a second rounder to move up ahead of the dolphins....time will tell...

on the flip side, if we are drafting at number 15 and players like OT Bulaga and CJ Spiller are there (and assuming rolando is gone), i think we are going to get some nice offers....new england for example has three second round picks and probably would love to get a guy like spiller (of course they might also put together a package and move up themselves to get someone like mcclain or someone else they like)....so if we do trade down maybe we can pick up the return number 1 and a second rounder or maybe even a second rounder and a 5th rounder if a bidding war develops.....and still bag someone like weatherspoon in round 1....

my thinking on a trade down would change if we do make some more moves in free agency....but as of right now we still have a lot of holes to fill, and more picks would be just the ticket.....think of this possible draft scenario with a trade down......sean weatherspoon round 1; brandon spikes first second round pick; jared odrick DT, dan williams DT, or mt cody DT with second second round pick; third round javier arenas CB, darrell stuckey S, dexter mccluster rb.or OG mike johnson......not bad....

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written by I Bleed Blue, March 07, 2010

I just heard that Jim Sorgi is scheduled to work out for the Giants tomorrow morning.

Jim Sorgi
written by TrueBlue, March 07, 2010

= tackling dummy.

I bleed blue
written by gman17, March 07, 2010

Bears GM Jerry Angelo and head coach Lovie Smith are on the hot seat. In November, I was in Chicago. Fans have soured on Lovie. With no first or second round picks, the Bears had no choice. The have to use free agency to upgrade their team. And for Angelo and Smith, if they do not win in 2010, they are done.

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